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An email exchange inspired by Next Testament. 5/7/03
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Sage Francis
Self Fighteous


Joined: 30 Jun 2002
Posts: 21558
An email exchange inspired by Next Testament. 5/7/03  Reply with quote  

From : "Scott H. Neibarger" <sneibarg@sbcglobal.net>
To : <sagefrancis@hotmail.com>

Subject :Next Testament

Date : Tue, 6 May 2003 19:41:56 -0500

Sadly, it makes me laugh that you can write about being metaphysical andspiritual, yet you write and sing songs about atheism and tossing the bibleaside. You deny the very source of a vast font of spiritual and metaphysicalknowledge. An intellectual who gloats about being really smart, but notquite a genius, will still find themselves accountable in the end. It's sadthat you wouldn't use your intellect to search further for the truth.I'm obsessed with the lyric: "all this pain and hurt is relative."Music sends a message, and I would say to you that sending the message to'look within yourself' is pretty good advice, but are you really qualifiedto give that sort of advice? How many humans are really introspective andhow many have to go to a therapist to understand themselves? I sometimeshave to wonder whether serious introspection lead to atrocities like AdolfHitler and Joseph Stalin; a God complex can cause some pretty maniacal thought.




MY RESPONSE:


Christianity...the key to closing your mind.

"I sometimeshave to wonder whether serious introspection lead to atrocities like Adolf Hitler and Joseph Stalin; a God complex can cause some pretty maniacal thought."

Funny...Nazis were Christian too.

The Bible is a good read. It has caused more senseless deaths than every disease combined. I am not arrogant enough to say that God doesn't exist. but I am also not arrogant enough to say who God is. Yes, look within yourself. No, don't justify inhumane actions based on what another man wrote. I follow my heart, which is guided by whatever spiritual power I am lucky enough to have. Some of us are born into a religion and are never granted the opportunity to consider what realities exist outside of its constraints. I do feel very lucky to have a family that promoted individual thought. I'll pray for you.
Post Wed May 07, 2003 9:31 am
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mr self distrukt



Joined: 01 Jul 2002
Posts: 1249
Location: a crew called self
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this sort of lends itself to my theory that repressed catholics make great artists.
i think something psychosomatic must happen that physically inhibits logical reasoning and replaces it with erratic thoughts and visions.
i think i need one more palm sunday under my belt and imma be the next gaudi.

serious introspection begat fascism? whaaaaa?
poor facial hair and god complexes don't kill millions, nations of scared subservient complacents do.

for that matter, Jesus spent 40 days in the desert doin some "serious introspection" and he already was God... hahaha.
Post Wed May 07, 2003 10:01 am
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Reggie



Joined: 01 Jul 2002
Posts: 5765
Location: Queens, NYC
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The Western mode of thinking requires that you form an opinion about everything, even if you don't know what you are talking about. (see the Vatican for more reference)

Eastern modes of thinking do not require concrete opinions, just a realization of things as they are--not as they should be.

This, I think, is the big difference between Judeo-Christian religions and the rest of the world philosophy/theology, though it is not the only one. I am aware, also, that these religions were all at one time "Eastern," but they aren't anymore.
Post Wed May 07, 2003 10:16 am
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The_Human



Joined: 30 Jan 2003
Posts: 1693
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I think Mr. Neibarger's spacebar had sperm stuck in it.
Post Wed May 07, 2003 10:27 am
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lambchop



Joined: 19 Feb 2003
Posts: 41
Location: hyannis,ma
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I was born into a Christian family, grew up studying the Bible, and was constantly surrounded by people who called themselves Christians. I didn't realize the impact it had on my life until I went away to college. My parents sent me to a private Christian college, the only college they would pay for. Up until that point I didn't drink or do drugs, period. But my freshman year the heathen inside of me finally had a chance to come out. I made friends with kids who were just like me. We had all been so sheltered and now hundreds of miles away from our parents we basically went nuts. I soon had a major drug problem, got arrested, a friend commited suicide, and of course I wasn't going to class. Needless to say I got kicked out after only 7 months. When I moved back home, the "Christians" who had supported and encouraged me throughout my adolescence completely abandoned me and talked about me behind my back. I stopped going to church and haven't been back since. My relationship with my parents gradually deteriorated as my drug and alcohol problem grew worse. I became severely depressed and at times thought about killing myself. Typical, obviously. I'm 26 now and live a much healthier lifestyle. I've had a lot of time to grow up and reflect on what's happened in my life. I know that the one thing that kept me going thru everything and the reason I'm still around is my faith in God. I turned my back on Christianity because I felt they had turned their backs on me. But I realize now that even people who call themselves Christians are obviously not perfect. They are human and make mistakes just like everyone else. And as long as we are humans there will be different interpretations of the Bible, the Koran, or whatever. The fact is you have to study for yourself and find out what you believe is right and what is important to you. It angers me when people go off on a rant about how stupid religion is and they have obviously not spent anytime studying any sort of religion. Probably never even opened the Bible. All they know is what other people have told them. They are just as bad as the close minded Christians who never question anything they are taught. My faith in God, not people and their teachings, has helped me develop into the open-minded and independant thinker I am today.
Post Wed May 07, 2003 10:27 am
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natekillz



Joined: 06 May 2003
Posts: 2
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good shit
Post Wed May 07, 2003 10:38 am
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emynd



Joined: 13 Mar 2003
Posts: 2786
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mr self distrukt wrote:
this sort of lends itself to my theory that repressed catholics make great artists.
i think something psychosomatic must happen that physically inhibits logical reasoning and replaces it with erratic thoughts and visions.
i think i need one more palm sunday under my belt and imma be the next gaudi.

serious introspection begat fascism? whaaaaa?
poor facial hair and god complexes don't kill millions, nations of scared subservient complacents do.

for that matter, Jesus spent 40 days in the desert doin some "serious introspection" and he already was God... hahaha.


This is one of my favorite posts I've read on this board.
Post Wed May 07, 2003 12:01 pm
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argot



Joined: 01 Jul 2002
Posts: 958
Location: rhode island
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Do mormons bang on your door like cops?
Post Wed May 07, 2003 2:20 pm
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The Dead Poet



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
Posts: 724
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
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i don't like when heads do this type of stuff...

i am a 'christan' and do read and put in play the bible in my life... but i would not try and force that on anyone else....

so when i see sage whom is one of my fav artist of all time say stuff like

"Christianity...the key to closing your mind. "
it makes me cringe. I am very open to new ideas and am constantly trying to open my mind and question what is going on around me. But for you sage to generalize Christianity is painful because that would include me and i don't feel that i am apart of what that man belives and is doing... i don't consider every dude that calls him self a follower of God a christan. I was brought up in a family aswell that allowed free thought. Yet was brought up by my Grandmother who informed my i am Catholic at the age of 3. I don't agree that you can be born into a religion. i do belive that religion is now this confused system of belifes that as the years go by gets more & more currupt. Its disgusting how its gotten. and all i can do is try and make sure that i'm doing what God wants. but now i'm rambiling on...

i guess what i'm trying to say is... please don't generalize that all christans have closed minds and are some morons that don't think and won't budge from there convictions. I guess this is the reason i label myself a disciple...

christan was originally a derogatory coment made to those 'christ-likes'. whatever
Post Wed May 07, 2003 2:30 pm
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SneepSnopDotCom
COCKRING WRAITH


Joined: 01 Jul 2002
Posts: 3087
Location: Wisconsin
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The bottom line is... anyone who has true faith in God would be happy as a pig in poop. It's a beautiful thought... a BEAUTIFUL thought... everlasting life in heaven with a bunch of bird men... God, I love that shit. The thing is though.... it seems the more faith you have in that, the more pissed you get at everyone else for thinking it's retarded. That's bird shit. Someone with true faith would just smirk at us idiots that are going to hell for our masturbating brains.
Post Wed May 07, 2003 2:35 pm
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MessiahCarey



Joined: 01 Jul 2002
Posts: 10924
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Christianity is a spritual discipline. One of the fundaments of ANY discipline is that it closes your mind to anything that lies outside the boundaries of that discipline.

Christianity is therefore, by default, closed-minded. It says "this is the truth" without accepting anything else as possibly holding the truth...error in the teachings of Christ aren't even EVALUATED much less questioned.

That doesn't make it wrong - it just closes the mind of those who choose it as the truth.

- Shane
Post Wed May 07, 2003 2:36 pm
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DM



Joined: 05 Jul 2002
Posts: 6371
Location: www.NERDTORIOUS.com
.......  Reply with quote  

"I'll pray for you."...hilarious. Religion is the opiate of the massess, a wise man once wrote. And like an opiate, it destroys the fabric of life.

abacus
Post Wed May 07, 2003 2:40 pm
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The Dead Poet



Joined: 13 Sep 2002
Posts: 724
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
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MessiahCarey wrote:
Christianity is a spritual discipline. One of the fundaments of ANY discipline is that it closes your mind to anything that lies outside the boundaries of that discipline.

Christianity is therefore, by default, closed-minded. It says "this is the truth" without accepting anything else as possibly holding the truth...error in the teachings of Christ aren't even EVALUATED much less questioned.

That doesn't make it wrong - it just closes the mind of those who choose it as the truth.

- Shane


but in that is that limiting me to what you say "chrisianity" is based on? I happen to be a beliver and i still study out other teachings and find truth in it.... i don't know. i think i'm done w/ this thread
Post Wed May 07, 2003 2:41 pm
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SneepSnopDotCom
COCKRING WRAITH


Joined: 01 Jul 2002
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Location: Wisconsin
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This all being said... to be an athiest is to be the opposite of an intellectual... Anyone who seriously claims they are a 100% athiest is a pea brain.
Post Wed May 07, 2003 2:48 pm
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MessiahCarey



Joined: 01 Jul 2002
Posts: 10924
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SneebDotCom wrote:
This all being said... to be an athiest is to be the opposite of an intellectual... Anyone who seriously claims they are a 100% athiest is a pea brain.


<sigh>

Here we go again.

Of course it's arrogant to assume there's no God. I would never do that. But to imply that atheists aren't intelligent is as stupid as me saying Christian people are stupid. One can be very intelligent and still disavow knowledge of, or accept, God.

Are you stating that the only true intellectual can be an agnostic (as I am)? I would disagree.

- Shane
Post Wed May 07, 2003 3:08 pm
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