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You know what scares the shit out of me?
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remind



Joined: 22 Jun 2008
Posts: 2202
Location: NJ
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AdamBomb wrote:
Taking it further, this makes me wonder if Sage gets annoyed when people are drunk at his shows when he himself does not drink.


Huh?
Post Wed Oct 06, 2010 7:17 pm
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SoSuhMe



Joined: 21 May 2010
Posts: 71
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iammessage wrote:
i moved to a small suburb of columbus recently (from columbus) and have had the pleasure of introducing a lot of "underground" music to a lot of kids i have met...and i often get the question "is this guy white?"...and when the artist IS white its followed by "ill have to check him out"...it has happened more than a few times...its weird, and uncomfortable....

i think there is a lot of underlying racism in many white rappers fan base...kids that are just plain racist and like the thought of a white guy being successful at a black art.


I actually get quite the obvious. I was playing Yelawolf in my car. My (white) friends were really digging it. Saying how cold his flow is and all that. They found out he was white...after that i get jeers and groans when i try to play Yelawolf. These are kids who really value their street cred. Em is the only white rapper they will listen to. Not even a Bun B stamp of approval helped Yela.

Another phenomena i encounter. I'll play an artist. They will usually say "turn this shit off its wack". Then it either hits the radio a few months later or a black person they look up to yet is still a "real nigga" says its dope and all the sudden they love the artist/song and act like they are the ones who put me up on it. I never get any credit :( lol. Most recent examples, Big K.R.I.T., Royce, J Cole, J Stalin, etc.

This is a cycle ive been dealing with for years. I've literally noticed at least a few of them started giving creedance to what im playing. They are starting to realize im putting them up on "hood/mtv" approved shit. Haha. God i hate people.
Post Wed Oct 06, 2010 7:22 pm
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Disharmony



Joined: 01 Jun 2003
Posts: 3027
Location: Buried in Minnesota dirt.
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Racism is good for making the blood boil. Next time it's boiling just toss some gingers in with those white racists and have yourself some gumbo.
Post Wed Oct 06, 2010 7:26 pm
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Bicycle



Joined: 17 Nov 2008
Posts: 413
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Mac Lethal wrote:
Bicycle wrote:
Well since racism is perfectly acceptable now its become a sorta game for us white kids. Its competative ignorance for the sake of fashion and shock value by people who got nothing to rebel against. These are the kids whos parents taught them otherwise. The actual racists are actually racist but its the same dynamic. They usually have better jokes though



Interesting point. I think I meant the actual racists. Not the ironic racists.

I mean genuinely racist people who have absolutely no idea how to interact with non-whites, have absolutely no grasp on the origin of hip-hop, yet are DIE HARD indieground hip-hop fans. Or Eminem fans. Or ICP fans/ Jugalows.


The incident you mentioned in the first post seems fairly indicative of the status quo. At least here in rural ass maine (96% white. None of us know how to interact with non-whites). Theres no irony to it. Its just "say something stupid". And its got nothing to do with indieground hiphop fans. The mainstream hiphop fans are the same way.
Post Wed Oct 06, 2010 7:31 pm
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al(phonic)



Joined: 12 May 2005
Posts: 779
Location: maine
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[quote=At least here in rural ass maine[/quote]

where you at?

i get the 'is he white' or 'hes white, right?' when i play things for people. drives me crazy. and its usually accompanied by smiling eyes that seem like unconscious white pride. i often answer the question with 'and it matters why?' and they back peddle

i dont think being against bling or gangsta rap is racism, though, its that many people dont relate to it and therefor feel awkward listening to it. its relating and personal taste

i think theres a lot of racism everywhre, even in people that would swear to not be. gestures and comments. like a guy isnt homophobic when he says 'i accept gays, as long as they dont touch me'. real accepting buddy. and whats up with 'acceptance' anyways? like a group needs to earn human-ness or entry into community
Post Wed Oct 06, 2010 7:57 pm
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sarah q



Joined: 02 Dec 2009
Posts: 175
Re: You know what scares the shit out of me?  Reply with quote  

laurapalmer wrote:
Mac Lethal wrote:


My friend Joe Good, essentially quit rap, because on tour a white dude came up to him and asked him if he could touch his hair.

I saw it happen. I may still quit rap because of it.


I just quit being white because of that story.


this.
Post Wed Oct 06, 2010 8:04 pm
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Dr Sagacious



Joined: 01 Mar 2009
Posts: 1843
Location: Redford
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How could one listen to someone like Del the Funky Homosapien, and be pissed that he's not white? How could one get pissed that any dope Black rapper isn't white?

White people are for the birds.

Weiss Leute gefällt mir nicht.

(Aber, Ich bin Weiss. Und sich beschämen nicht.)
Post Wed Oct 06, 2010 10:33 pm
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Confidential



Joined: 23 Jan 2004
Posts: 2040
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"i think that by making racist jokes it takes away the power of racism." No guy, ironic racism won't help us not get searched by the police. Carlos Mencia set us back.

http://www.racialicious.com/2008/09/18/cultural-appropriation-homage-or-insult/

http://aalbc.com/reviews/everything_but_the_burden.htm

Everything but the Burden: What White People Are Taking from Black Culture
Click to order via Amazon

by Greg Tate (Editor)

ISBN: 0767908082
Format: Hardcover, 272pp
Pub. Date: January 2003
Publisher: Broadway Books
Edition Description: 1ST

Reviewed by Rondall Brasher for AALBC.com

"Of all of our studies, history is best qualified to reward ourresearch."
--El Hajj Malik El Shabazz (Malcolm X)

This quote could very well accent the depth of what "Everything but the Burden: What White People Are Taking From Black Culture" attempts to fulfill. "Everything but the Burden" is an anthology of cultural essays edited by Greg Tate, a cultural critic and writer for the Village Voice. The book sets out to examine the osmosis of Black culture into White society. It also focuses on the realization that no matter how prevalent this osmosis may be the result is still a filtered and homogenized version of what it really means to be Black. In other words, whites get to act black, talk black, dress black, and assume the elements of a black life without having the stress of being black or, for that matter, staying black.

The essays are built on the central theme of Whites pillaging blacks of their culture, but leaving the burdens and stresses of racism, poverty, social stigma, etc. Tate and the other essayists seem to expand upon the controversial essay, "The White Negro" written by Norman Mailer in 1957. Forty-five years later white America's tendency to view blacks as objects rather than people are even more pronounced. Greg Tate, in his riveting essay, "Nigs R Us, or How Black folk Became Fetish Objects," wrestles with the observation that blacks are perceived as stereotypical hypersexual and/or near super-men/women physically. While this warped idolization may inspire backhanded imitation, it continues the degeneration of blacks to objects.

Tate's work is just the beginning of a goody bag of essays that feed upon and support one another. While Everything but the Burden is written on an elevated intellectual level it does not come off as pompous. The authors used metaphorical examples from subjects ranging from Greek mythology to the near deification of some Black music icons. Everything but the Burden not only required an extensive of research on the part of many of the essayists, but also displayed a cross section of historic, cultural, and economic knowledge on blacks' experiences in America. Tate's editing has ensured that the book not only examines the "Hip Hop" era (e.g. his seething lambaste of Eminem and his pimp Dr. Dre), but also delves into cultural phenomena in the roots of soul and rock and roll, and its effects in Africa.

In the essay, "The 1960s in Bamako: Malick Sidibe and James Brown," author Manthia Diawara writes about the music of James Brown and its influence on the (social and political) consciousness in Mali in the 1960s. Another striking and brilliant essay is Meri Nana-Ama Danquah's "Afro-Kinky Human Hair". Danquah discusses her recent return to Ghana, only to find that the people of her native land had acquired an overt fascination with all that is White/European. The infestation of European culture had become so rife among Ghanaians that they had formed themselves into European caricatures. Whoa...

Everything but the Burden will set a new standard for intellectual discussion about Black culture. Everything but the Burden is a masterful collection of thoughts by Black 'culturalists'. The catechization works throughout the book, but offers no solutions to the continued co-opting of black American culture. Perhaps Greg Tate has amassed essays that are meant to cause Blacks and Whites to think about what is going on? Maybe it is up to us as a society to provide the answers to our own problems? Everything but the Burden does an excellent job of bringing us closer to self-examination. The book is a must have for those who "continue to carry the burden."


Greg Tate Bio:
A cultural critic for The Village Voice, Greg Tate is also the author of Flyboy in the Buttermilk and contributes regularly to national publications such as Rolling Stone, VIBE, and the New York Times. In addition, he helped found the Black Rock Coalition, produced two albums on his own label, and composed a libretto that was performed at the Apollo Theater. He lives in New York City.


On the other hand I recently discovered that being the group of color at a metal show is kind of fun.
Post Wed Oct 06, 2010 11:29 pm
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Captiv8



Joined: 25 Aug 2006
Posts: 8547
Location: Third Coast
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I think part of the issue at work here is one of identification. What can this group identify with over that group, and so on. So when some impressionable kids hear rappers talking about something similar to their own lives that becomes their own cross to bear proudly, like a badge of honor, which simulataneously estranges them from the original culture of music like hip hop. What this does is establish a classic "us" versus "them" mentality, even if it's subconscious. When this happens the origins of the artform become less important than its contemporary practice, and thus the question of authenticity becomes grounded in characteristics that are, for all intents and purposes, race-related to the casual listener.
Post Wed Oct 06, 2010 11:43 pm
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Confidential



Joined: 23 Jan 2004
Posts: 2040
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I don't know man, group identificaton is part of it, but the way you frame it makes racism sound like a secondary effect as opposed to something that's always present on some level, and in some form or another in our various "scenes". No?
Post Wed Oct 06, 2010 11:56 pm
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Confidential



Joined: 23 Jan 2004
Posts: 2040
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MAC i think it's interesting that you bring this up after your South Africa Tour. Did touring there give you some kind of insight or new awareness of all this?
Post Wed Oct 06, 2010 11:58 pm
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Mac Lethal
the one with the back hair


Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Posts: 1920
Location: kc
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Confidential wrote:
MAC i think it's interesting that you bring this up after your South Africa Tour. Did touring there give you some kind of insight or new awareness of all this?


Just seeing the aftermath of apartheid, how deeply divided people are there, and seeing first hand how it affected them has made me very sensitive to racism in general.

The thing is, while I disagree with it, I guess I understand the logic of *some* ironic racism. I just think there needs to be a less hurtful, more honest approach towards it.

And to the Maine guy, I am speaking specifically about white indie/underground hip-hop fans.
Post Thu Oct 07, 2010 12:31 am
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poisonfree



Joined: 23 Aug 2002
Posts: 1522
Location: Macramento
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yes Mac.

That is definitely true.

It's the every day language of white racism.

which is a great book by the way.
Post Thu Oct 07, 2010 2:25 am
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smake



Joined: 13 Apr 2006
Posts: 682
Location: The Netherlands
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Interesting topic. Read a lot of sound arguments here. My two cents then: for me it has a lot to do with identification I guess. I find tracks that I can relate to more often more enjoyable.

I hope I phrase it well, but I do have less with tracks about "bling bling" or the "ghetto". Mostly though, I have very little with the top50 hiphop tracks that seem to capitalize on being "a gangster". Tracks about a hard life, like K'naans "Smile" do grab me (not that I can relate with the horrors in that song, just saying I like the track and it grabs me).

I also have very little with the culture of hip-hop I admit. I didn't listen to hiphop then, and those tracks now aren't my cup of tea. So I don't delve into it and I won't delve into it. I do know where the current sound comes from and how important those artists were, and I have the utmost respect for that. If that music somehow shaped the artists that I like now, great.

It really troubles me if people only listen to "white" hiphop because it's by "white people". As said, I like tracks more that are a bit closer to me. Also, there is ofcourse a difference between artists that grew up in different parts, who had different lifestyles and events happen, etc. The music itself (not the words) differs too.

So, little difficult to summarize, but for me, I think relating is a big part, and ofcourse the style of music, which can differ a lot. People ignorant of the impact of hiphop artists back in the days are foolish. People who only listen to "white" hiphop because it is made by white people are terrible rascists. Listen to the music that touches you and connects with you, from which you can get something, not because it is made by someone who happens to have the same color as you.
Post Thu Oct 07, 2010 3:30 am
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Lants



Joined: 07 Aug 2006
Posts: 2234
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by posting here, i know that seandaley is going to call me a racist Australian.
so be it.

the n_____ word makes me uncomfortable both in songs and when people say it 'ironically'. i don't think i have ever actually uttered the word out loud. maybe sang to it in my head through wutang or something. i'm not into karaoke so i'm okay there.
Post Thu Oct 07, 2010 7:32 am
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