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Offensive ad gaining attention (Tsunami ad ref. 9/11)
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Strange Famous Forum > Social stuff. Political stuff. KNOWMORE

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jakethesnake
guy who cried about wrestling being real


Joined: 03 Feb 2006
Posts: 6311
Location: airstrip one
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I'm still trying to figure out what people in the US are supposed to be thinking about here that we're not. Do people from other countries just assume that since we made a big deal out of 9/11 that we don't care about natural disasters? The US probably deals with that just as much as any place else I'd say. Floods, tornadoes, hurricanes, ice storms, blizzards, wildfires, any time of the year really some place in the US is probably being hit by a natural disaster. Not only that, coverage over the Tsunami was all over the news here for weeks. We're not completely ignorant to what is going on in the rest of the world.

I'm honestly really trying to wrap my head around that comment still. When was the last time someone bombed Iceland and killed a few thousand people and destroyed a significant part of a major metropolis?
Post Wed Sep 02, 2009 8:06 am
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Plum Puddin'



Joined: 26 May 2008
Posts: 1829
Location: Run Ebola, Run.
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Nearly 50% of the worlds scientists are assigned to military projects.
Post Thu Sep 03, 2009 12:18 am
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Sarcastro



Joined: 27 Sep 2002
Posts: 3281
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Plum Puddin' wrote:
Nearly 50% of the worlds scientists are assigned to military projects.


An optimist would say more than 50% of the world's scientists are assigned to non-military projects. Way to show your true colours.
Post Thu Sep 03, 2009 6:49 am
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cakes



Joined: 15 Dec 2006
Posts: 2586
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Plum Puddin' wrote:
Nearly 50% of the worlds scientists are assigned to military projects.
where'd this number come from? out of what kinds of scientists? all scientists? how are we even defining "scientist"? what are you assuming about what it means?

i know a lot of engineers who work with raytheon. that doesn't mean they technically work for the military, but the military contracts raytheon a lot. out of the three who i actually know what they do, one of them is somehow related to nuclear power, one of them works on electronics with the navy to create more efficient ships so that they can run on less man power, and the third runs the systems on scientific ships in antarctica who study oceanography, global warming, and anything else you would want to know about the arctic.
Post Thu Sep 03, 2009 7:09 am
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Sarcastro



Joined: 27 Sep 2002
Posts: 3281
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Wow..............WOW
this was no spec ad, these idiots loved the idea so much that they made it into a 30 second ad, and then on top of that, submitted it to award shows
Bravo DDB Brazil, bravo

Post Thu Sep 03, 2009 7:37 am
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neveragainlikesheep



Joined: 22 May 2008
Posts: 2536
Location: TKO from Tokyo
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It is about at this time that people stop thinking with their rational, logic based mind and start getting indignant about an event that while tragic pales in comparison with dozens of events that the vast majority of the people in this country didn't even know happened.

Personally, it's a great point. While we obsess over 9/11 millions die daily on account of our lifestyle choices, not to mention a whole host of other things we are all remotely accountable for. If you don't like the point they made, it's OK. You can keep your blinders on for as long as you want. It doesn't mean that they aren't correct.
Post Thu Sep 03, 2009 7:47 am
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jakethesnake
guy who cried about wrestling being real


Joined: 03 Feb 2006
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Location: airstrip one
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Yeah, like those damn vegetarians killing the amazon rainforest because they eat soy that is farmed there.

And someone explain how the fuck a Tsunami in the Philippines is created due to my lifestyle.

This thread is dumb.
Post Thu Sep 03, 2009 8:28 am
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Captiv8



Joined: 25 Aug 2006
Posts: 8547
Location: Third Coast
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jakethesnake wrote:
And someone explain how the fuck a Tsunami in the Philippines is created due to my lifestyle.


Butterfly effect, baby. Maybe next time you'll think twice about being a consumer.
Post Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:18 am
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cakes



Joined: 15 Dec 2006
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neveragainlikesheep wrote:
It is about at this time that people stop thinking with their rational, logic based mind and start getting indignant about an event that while tragic pales in comparison with dozens of events that the vast majority of the people in this country didn't even know happened.
Personally, it's a great point. While we obsess over 9/11 millions die daily on account of our lifestyle choices, not to mention a whole host of other things we are all remotely accountable for. If you don't like the point they made, it's OK. You can keep your blinders on for as long as you want. It doesn't mean that they aren't correct.

What events are you referring to that this image is representing other than the natural disaster? And can you really claim that the tsunami was directly related to your life choices? Of course there are more events than we could ever mention or most likely will ever know about. More people have died in Darfur than the tsunami. More people died in Armenia than the tsunami. Shit in Afghanistan is getting seriously intense. There have been a number of massacres that the world doesn’t talk or know about, but this add isn’t saying that. And we could do more about it, and we could do less. And the media is biased, but this doesn’t imply that we’re completely blind to it all. Is it directed at the people or the government? Should they be considered the same thing?

Of course it's important to care, but I'm not going to pretend that I don’t care in a different way when it hits that close to home. It's human nature to protect your family. And I'm not going to claim that I don't choose to put my efforts towards problems we face here, because we do have a shit number of issues here that also need attention. If we focus on local issues, and we're talking about the butterfly effect, shouldn't that matter? My local selectman turned mayor could become the next state senator theoretically, who could run for president, who could appear to call all the shots. How far down the trail do you follow to claim a true cause? Does it matter where you stop along the line if you want to break that chain of events?

I'm not obsessed with 9-11, but I didn't lose my family in it. I do think that people responded very severely, but I can’t say I really blame them for it. And using it as a vehicle for other prerogatives isn’t all that cool, but this ad says shit about any of that. Wasn’t the event the largest single terrorist attack claimed? I don’t know enough about this source to stand by it, but it seems that way: http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/terrorism/wrjp255i.html
maybe more people have died from the response, but in theory, there's no way to prove how many would have died without it.

By stating "your blinders", are you claiming your personal blinders are off? Their point is that more people died in the tsunami, anything else is interpretation on the readers end. besides, it doesn't say anything about support given or aid provided. Thus, this ad doesn’t make a great point. you just want it to because you think that, but you probably don't know nearly as much as you think you do. And though it's a start, simply admitting there's stuff you don't know doesn't cut it either; we all know that part.

I don't claim to know much about anything (I still don't know what the tiny words say), i study math and craziness, but i do think this debate has been beaten before. i'm with jake.
Post Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:47 am
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Captiv8



Joined: 25 Aug 2006
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Location: Third Coast
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I think a more powerful ad would have been something about Hiroshima or Nagasaki, with words like "America is the real terrorist." I don't know how that would tie-in to the WWF, but it would work well for some kind campaign for peace in the Middle East.
Post Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:08 am
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Windom



Joined: 04 May 2007
Posts: 721
Location: Manchester, UK.
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Yeah I agree that this ad isn’t very successful. I can see Tommi’s likening it to PETA’s ads – any worthwhile message is swamped by the way it’s presented. I do think its interesting though by presenting such a stark image and having an ambiguous message, how the ad is successful in how people react to it and put their own spin on things. The lifestyle angle seems pretty weak. Maybe you could stretch it to ask why there isn’t tsunami detection devices in poorer regions of the world or point to how a lot of the people affected were in fishing communities, poor coastal regions compared to large, wealthier cities. Maybe you could even go as far to say that wealthier people in Western countries for example, are not only accountable for the things they consume, buy etc, but accountable for things they don’t buy or give to i.e. disaster relief charities. Grasping at straws though.
Post Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:51 am
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Windom



Joined: 04 May 2007
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Location: Manchester, UK.
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Re-reading about the 2004 tsunami. It's pretty disgraceful of the $7 billion dollars of aid pledged, $4 billion has never been received. Not the first time this has happened. This is more heartwarming though:


Quote:


Many charities were given considerable donations from the public. For example, in the UK the public donated roughly £330,000,000 sterling (nearly US$600,000,000). This considerably outweighed the donation by the government and came to an average of about £5.50 (US$10) donated by every citizen.
Post Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:55 am
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cakes



Joined: 15 Dec 2006
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i can def see that, Captiv. however, if you're talking strictly death tolls, according to wikipedia roughly 140,000 people died in Hiroshima, 80,000 in Nagasaki, and roughly 5,933,900 Jews during WWII, and that doesn't include other populations killed as a part of the Holocaust (depending on your definition because other populations were targeted). Yes, all still significanly more than 9-11, but the tsunami as well. Yea, I'm including massacres in terrorism. Point is there's always something, unfortunately.

And speaking on natural disasters:
Ten deadliest natural disasters wrote:

1. 1931 China floods China July-November, 1931 1,000,000–4,000,000
2. 1887 Yellow River flood China - September-October, 1887 900,000–2,000,000
3. 1556 Shaanxi earthquake Shaanxi Province, China - January 23, 1556 830,000
4. 1970 Bhola cyclone Bangladesh - November 13, 1970 500,000
5. 1839 India Cyclone India - November 25, 1839 300,000
6. 526 Antioch earthquake Antioch, Byzantine Empire - May 20, 526 250,000
7. 1976 Tangshan earthquake Tangshan, Hebei, China - July 28, 1976 242,000
8. 1920 Haiyuan earthquake Haiyuan, Ningxia-Gansu, China - December 26, 1920 240,000
9. 1975 Banqiao Dam flood Zhumadian, Henan Province, China - August 7, 1975 90,000–230,000
10. 2004 Indian Ocean earthquake/tsunami Indian Ocean - December 26, 2004 229,866

sure the theory is that it's getting worse, but can we blame the hummers on these? sorry, i'm just really annoyed with this apparently. I still don't know too much because i never got a's in history class.

and i def see why people criticized aid and response, but it's tough to really sift through sometimes. and that's not something that's just related to international business. initial Katrina responses from the us government weren't praised either.
Post Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:56 am
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Majawala



Joined: 14 Oct 2005
Posts: 1806
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neveragainlikesheep wrote:


Personally, it's a great point. While we obsess over 9/11 millions die daily on account of our lifestyle choices, not to mention a whole host of other things we are all remotely accountable for. If you don't like the point they made, it's OK. You can keep your blinders on for as long as you want. It doesn't mean that they aren't correct.


"They’ll say the IMF is arrogant. They’ll say the IMF doesn’t really listen to the developing countries it is supposed to help. They’ll say the IMF is secretive and insulated from democratic accountability. They’ll say the IMF’s economic ‘remedies’ often make things worse – turning slowdowns into recessions and recessions into depressions. And they’ll have a point. I was chief economist at the World Bank from 1996 until last November, during the gravest global economic crisis in a half-century. I saw how the IMF, in tandem with the U.S. Treasury Department, responded. And I was appalled."
_joseph stiglitz

you can't blame people being people. but you can blame specific organizations charged to help developing countries.
Post Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:08 am
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vintge
is vintge vince? vince vintge vincge?


Joined: 17 Jul 2002
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Location: LA
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futuristxen wrote:
Mikal kHill wrote:
That would make awesome backside-of-an-album art...

-kHill


I know right.
Or a frontside of an album if you're the coup.

I think it's a pretty intense image. I would watch that movie. It would involve Wesley Snipes have to jump through Nick Cage's brain ala John Malkovich into each plane to stop what...200 terrorist plots.

And then at the end, he punches a tsunami with his vampire smighting fist and taunts it with some sort of pithy one liner like "motherfucking snakes aren't gonna hang me out to dry".

Tracy Morgan would play his contact on the ground, and he would be...FLIPPING OUT. Like the whole movie.

Also Wesley Snipes character is retarded. or braindicapped.



hahahaha awesome.
Post Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:23 am
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