Profile
Search
Register
Log in
hey ladies! get funky.
View previous topic | View next topic >

Post new topic Reply to topic
Strange Famous Forum > Social stuff. Political stuff. KNOWMORE

Author Message
Jesse



Joined: 02 Jul 2002
Posts: 6166
Location: privileged homeless
 Reply with quote  

surge> well at least we've both made our positions clear... I guess that constitutes a successful argument...

*shake* good match
Post Wed Apr 30, 2003 4:57 pm
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Nope



Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Posts: 1916
 Reply with quote  

Jesse wrote:
surge> well at least we've both made our positions clear... I guess that constitutes a successful argument...

*shake* good match


oh geez here I thought we were going to go on pointlessly for 10 more pages :)

If only more arguments in general could end like this (not only on this board)

peace
Post Wed Apr 30, 2003 5:04 pm
 View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Jesse



Joined: 02 Jul 2002
Posts: 6166
Location: privileged homeless
 Reply with quote  

it's hard to find that magic point where you've said all you can say without really, really getting deep and you don't think anyone's likely to get much more out of the argument... so pick up and move on... actually I might have been a little late with it this time, but it worked okay. ^_^
Post Wed Apr 30, 2003 5:27 pm
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Nope



Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Posts: 1916
 Reply with quote  

Jesse wrote:
it's hard to find that magic point where you've said all you can say without really, really getting deep and you don't think anyone's likely to get much more out of the argument... so pick up and move on... actually I might have been a little late with it this time, but it worked okay. ^_^


You didn't get back to the argument till 2 pages after your original post. It went on a little longer than it should have by other people taking what I was saying out of context.

which happens very often...I think people tend to assume what somebody "really" means through text on a messageboard just like they do when they're talking to somebody out in "the real world" instead of just simply taking things at face value. Or other times people seem to go on about a point that was never made...who knows why. I think I argued my point pretty clearly this time.
Post Wed Apr 30, 2003 5:35 pm
 View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Abduct0ne1



Joined: 11 Apr 2003
Posts: 112
 Reply with quote  

Personally i get wierd if i hook up with a chick and she wants to have sex and ive only hooked up with her like a few times. if shes that easy to fuck then imagine all the people she got with that took up her offer.. i,in a few cases, hooked up with people and asked them if they wanted to have sex and when they said yes, im like " i was kidding, thats kinda fucked up, ive hooked up with you like twice". i dont want to be another person on some slutty girls list who she had in her.Im not saying that a girl is a slut if she wants to have sex but if its that easy i dont feel special in any way. i feel like another person on her list. Plus that all comes together when gettingserious with a girl. I always thnk the worst and always am worried i am gonna get cheated on. If she does cheat on me and she seems like she used to be one of "those girls", i get more nervous. instead of me thinking of her kissing someone else i think of her trying to fuck them since she appeared that easy... sorry if this doesnt make sence but i get freaked out about going out with people.
Post Wed Apr 30, 2003 8:42 pm
 View user's profile Send private message
sleeklegend



Joined: 05 Jul 2002
Posts: 807
 Reply with quote  

On a similar note...

about people who are "sluts", or have sex often, I agree that it is not my position to impose my views on sexual morality upon them. However, for the sake of argument, what about the idea that people who DO feel obligated to have sex with many different partners lack a certain self-respect for their bodies? There are lots of corresponding evidence involving sexual abuse or lack of self-esteem with the amount of sex people have....is it fair (not to make this an ethics argument)...is it reasonable for someone to consider this a fault in someone?

One could argue that having lots of sex is actually psychologically unhealthy, and therefore it is "bad" by nature...like other mental disorders. While I don't agree with placing labels on people, could we consider in some cases these people psychologically messed up in some manner? What then? Still take the idea that people should do whatever they want...

There is always a sort of problem with complete tolerance, unfortunately. It makes it so that people who actually are detrimental to people in general are excused.

What of the "slut" who gives 95 different guys diseases (there are more problems than overpopulation)? It's okay, it was her choice?

What of the other people involved?

This isn't a last minute plea for me to need to call people sluts...I personally am not advocating anything in particular, I just felt like approaching it from a different angle

I don't know, just a thought.
Post Wed Apr 30, 2003 8:53 pm
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail AIM Address
tie-my-shoe



Joined: 30 Jun 2002
Posts: 450
Location: university of virginia
 Reply with quote  

girls smell nice :)
Post Wed Apr 30, 2003 10:56 pm
 View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
MessiahCarey



Joined: 01 Jul 2002
Posts: 10924
 Reply with quote  

sleeklegend wrote:
what about the idea that people who DO feel obligated to have sex with many different partners lack a certain self-respect for their bodies? There are lots of corresponding evidence involving sexual abuse or lack of self-esteem with the amount of sex people have....is it fair (not to make this an ethics argument)...is it reasonable for someone to consider this a fault in someone?


Yes, it is a fault in someone if they use ANYTHING (not just sex) to make up for a lack of self-respect.

Yet, you would have to know that person personally to understand that is what they're doing, no? You can't simply make the assumption (nor did you claim to) that they are doing it for psychologically self-serving reasons.


Quote:

One could argue that having lots of sex is actually psychologically unhealthy, and therefore it is "bad" by nature


You can't leave it unqualified like that. Only if the person is using sex to make up for a lack of self-worth is it psychologically unhealthy. If it is consensual and the person doing it is doing it for the sheer pleasure of sharing the experience (not because they feel as if they HAVE to) then there's no way it's unhealthy - on the contrary, one could argue that it's quite healthy as many beleive that our bodies are made to mate much more than they do (lions and tigers don't date. They find females of the species, chase them, catch them and fuck them - they don't go through the hoopla that humans do).


Quote:

There is always a sort of problem with complete tolerance, unfortunately. It makes it so that people who actually are detrimental to people in general are excused.

What of the "slut" who gives 95 different guys diseases (there are more problems than overpopulation)? It's okay, it was her choice?

What of the other people involved?


Both parties had a choice. Having sex, unprotected, with multiple partners is STUPID. I could judge them on their stupidity, but not their morality. If we're talking about a woman who intentionally gives her partners the diseases you speak of, then the morality is not flawed because of the sex - it's because she felt it was acceptable to harm other people...sex is merely the vehicle she used...if she had a "herpes gun" and used that instead you'd have the same effect. Heh.


Quote:


I don't know, just a thought.


In fact, a few of them. ;-)

- Shane
Post Thu May 01, 2003 7:09 am
 View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Nope



Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Posts: 1916
 Reply with quote  

Shane....I want to see if you agree with me on this

there is no one thing that can be applied to everything...there is no one solution or one way by which something can be approached

there is no universal bad, nor good

everything must be looked at in an individual basis

You've been running with this "if you don't know the people personally and the case itself well, then you have no right to pass judgement" thing...and it leads me to believe that you might agree with that above

funny that you were never disagreeing with me...because I was talking about people that I knew and specific things that would warrant the use of the word (in my mind).

I think you have your own agenda here :)
Post Thu May 01, 2003 8:06 am
 View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Random Sample



Joined: 12 Aug 2002
Posts: 2460
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
 Reply with quote  

I think being a slut is all in someone's persona. I know ladies that sleep with a bunch of guys. They just enjoy sex. They are very clean girls who take care of themselves, they act very mature, and are very secure with their sexuality.

Then you have these girls that are always biligerant, go and sleep with random dudes, have this bad attitude, and are disgraceful. That is who I find to be sluts.

It is not how many dudes that a woman sleeps with it is how she carries herself when she sleeps with them. I agree with the older that you get the number of people that you have slept with becomes irrelevant unless it is a rediculous number.
Post Thu May 01, 2003 8:17 am
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
weedy420
Guest




 Reply with quote  

hatinphonies wrote:
the fact that u sleep around with anybody and everybody makes you a skank, whether ure a guy or a girl.



damn straight, im a guy and my brother and his friends still call me a male slut cause i like to sleep with females. its not my fault i like sex
Post Thu May 01, 2003 8:34 am
 
MessiahCarey



Joined: 01 Jul 2002
Posts: 10924
 Reply with quote  

RandomSurge wrote:
Shane....I want to see if you agree with me on this

there is no one thing that can be applied to everything...there is no one solution or one way by which something can be approached

there is no universal bad, nor good

everything must be looked at in an individual basis

You've been running with this "if you don't know the people personally and the case itself well, then you have no right to pass judgement" thing...and it leads me to believe that you might agree with that above

funny that you were never disagreeing with me...because I was talking about people that I knew and specific things that would warrant the use of the word (in my mind).

I think you have your own agenda here :)


My agenda, if there is one, is always to promote freethinking. I don't like the idea of being judged based on my sexuality - so I make certain that I try and limit my judgement of others using such grounds. If I see someone not adhering to that policy, I speak up.

So yeah - perhaps what I was speaking on wasn't particularly something YOU were doing. Who knows...I would have to look back on a million posts to figure it out and I really don't care to. ;-)

Perhaps my agenda was to point out what I have seen as a long-term hypocrisy. Many of the people who say that being gay is acceptable also condemn heterosexual women or men for having sex with great frequency. It is an inconsistant opinion - because the fundamental reasoning around accepting homosexuality is accepting the notion that it is unhealthy to judge another based on how they choose to partake in sexual behaviour. I don't think that the non-judgemental requirement stops with homosexuality - for a true and healthy acceptance of sexuality to exist it is my opinion that we have to not only accept what gender someone chooses to have sex with, but the frequency with which they do it. Of course, as we've gotten into, we can furthermore judge what they do in order to acquire sexual partners - but a desire for sex and the manipulation of people for it, in my mind, are two seperate entities.

It's the same argument I use for not judging those who use drugs simply on the merit that they use drugs - only if drugs become more important than other basic human responsibilities to a person can I judge him/her negatively. I have to accept that people may do things that are not within my personal moral structure. I am, save the mistakes humans tend to make, monogomous - and have been for as long as I can remember. I find that sex with a lot of people doesn't intrigue me, nor do I find it an acceptable mode of behaviour for myself...yet I fully accept that if someone chooses it as a lifestyle I have no reason to judge them. Of course, we all make mistakes and I get judgemental from time to time - but recognizing it is the first step towards fixing it.

So yeah...maybe I was using this as a way to express an ideology I've had no outlet for in the past - thanks. ;-)

- Shane
Post Thu May 01, 2003 8:54 am
 View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
ruins



Joined: 12 Mar 2003
Posts: 27
Location: the orange county, ca.
 Reply with quote  

i've never thought of guys that have a lot of sex with girls as 'playas'. it equates to a girl whoring it up. they're doing the same thing. it's their choice to get on down. it's just not anything that's for me right now, nor has it ever been.
Post Thu May 01, 2003 10:43 am
 View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address
mr.oblivious



Joined: 16 Oct 2002
Posts: 100
 Reply with quote  

sex feels great.
Post Thu May 01, 2003 10:52 am
 View user's profile Send private message
Jesse



Joined: 02 Jul 2002
Posts: 6166
Location: privileged homeless
 Reply with quote  

abductone>

Quote:

Personally i get wierd if i hook up with a chick and she wants to have sex and ive only hooked up with her like a few times. if shes that easy to fuck then imagine all the people she got with that took up her offer..


My first question is: why? Why imagine that? That is, what's the problem here, in your opinion?


Quote:

i dont want to be another person on some slutty girls list who she had in her.


What do you want, a ring? What meets your criteria for enough contact before sex that makes you two healthy individuals rather than a slut and a sucker?


Quote:

Im not saying that a girl is a slut if she wants to have sex but if its that easy i dont feel special in any way.


Perhaps it is not the responsibility of a girl to make you feel special in anyway?


Quote:

i feel like another person on her list.


You are. You always will be, and she always be another person on your "list". People who practise monogamy have sequentially arranged relationships, it amounts to a "list" of sorts. I still don't see the problem as you've suggested it.


Quote:

Plus that all comes together when gettingserious with a girl. I always thnk the worst and always am worried i am gonna get cheated on. If she does cheat on me and she seems like she used to be one of "those girls", i get more nervous. instead of me thinking of her kissing someone else i think of her trying to fuck them since she appeared that easy...


So I guess what you're saying is that you don't think someone who has sex on a whim or easily is trustworthy? I think that's a pretty clear separate issue, unless you know she's sleeping with YOU behind someone else's back, in which case you're complicit to begin with.

I don't agree that promiscuity is tantamount to infidelity.

----

sleeklegend>

Quote:

what about the idea that people who DO feel obligated to have sex with many different partners lack a certain self-respect for their bodies?


What about the idea that people who have sex with many different partners don't neccessarily do so because they "feel obligated"? I think that the self-respect issue is one that's only compounded by societal contempt for promiscuity... people (particularly, but not only, chicks) sink into shame for even wanting to fuck ANYone... once they start to feel worthless, it's all to easy for them to start behaving the way people expect them to, while retaining their own values on the matter, condemning themselves, and it's self-perpetuating.

I don't think that's the only mindset that results in promiscuity, however.


Quote:

There are lots of corresponding evidence involving sexual abuse or lack of self-esteem with the amount of sex people have....is it fair (not to make this an ethics argument)...is it reasonable for someone to consider this a fault in someone?


Well, in a strict sense I suppose you could call it a fault, but you're sort of putting the cart before the horse here whether it's an ethical judgement or not. There's lots of corresponding evidence involving runny noses with having a cold, but it's not as though you can prevent colds by blowing your nose once it's stuffed up.


Quote:

One could argue that having lots of sex is actually psychologically unhealthy, and therefore it is "bad" by nature...like other mental disorders.


I wouldn't mind a bit of a demonstration, there. I'd be surprised if I heard a terribly compelling argument towards that point.


Quote:

While I don't agree with placing labels on people, could we consider in some cases these people psychologically messed up in some manner?


"These people" as in promiscuous people, or "these people" as in people who are promiscuous because they are emotionally troubled? You've sort of set yourself up an easy run here, because you've already defined the group you're referring to as being psychologically messed up in some manner.


Quote:

What then? Still take the idea that people should do whatever they want...


Well even in the event that a person's emotional troubles are a clear impetus for their sexual behaviour, you have to take a question like that on a case-by-case basis. Does the behaviour exacerbate the problem? What IS the behaviour? What IS the problem? You can't just say "People who have sex a lot have problems and it would help their problems if they didn't have sex so much." This is too broad.


Quote:

What of the "slut" who gives 95 different guys diseases


OH HO! Here's a hot little number. We are now discussing the Detroit Rapper brand Slut (tm), the mythical, magical origin of sexually transmitted diseases.

I don't even know if I should take up this thing right now... on the one hand, it's one of my pet crusades... but on the other hand, I find it difficult to take the underlying concept (the scheming germ factory) seriously.

I'm gonna leave it for right now. I have a soundcheck to get to.


Quote:

(there are more problems than overpopulation)?


Given that overpopulation is an outrageously falsified concern, particularly in our culture/location, I'd bloody well say so.


Quote:

It's okay, it was her choice? What of the other people involved?


Yes, what of them? The helpless puppets she brainwashes and rapes in the raw deal? Surely the onus is upon her alone to protect them! Surely she ensared them with her wicked charms, bitterly imposing her own rightful fate upon them!


Quote:

This isn't a last minute plea for me to need to call people sluts...I personally am not advocating anything in particular, I just felt like approaching it from a different angle


Word up, and it is appreciated. I hope you don't interpret my responses as vicious towards you or anything... I fight the words, not the speaker(typer). I may have got a little sardonic towards the end, but let's just play it where it lies... it's not personal, right?

--

messiah>

Quote:

My agenda, if there is one, is always to promote freethinking.


Conversely, my agenda - if there is one - is always to promote promiscuity. I won't for a moment suggest that my position is unbound by personal bias or worldview. I have a position, and I'm promoting it. Hope that's cool with everyone. ^_^
Post Thu May 01, 2003 2:59 pm
 View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website

Post new topic Reply to topic
Jump to:  
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
All times are GMT - 6 Hours.
The time now is Tue Oct 21, 2014 7:44 am
  Display posts from previous:      


Powered by phpBB: © 2001 phpBB Group
Template created by The Fathom
Based on template of Nick Mahon