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war in iraq was not a bad thing
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Strange Famous Forum > Social stuff. Political stuff. KNOWMORE

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Wordsmyth
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war in iraq was not a bad thing  Reply with quote  

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The four women ? Maha Hussain, Zainab al-Suwaij, Katrin Michael and Roz Rasool ? told ABCNEWS' Barbara Salters stories that could be punishable by death in Saddam Hussein's Iraq. Even Iraqis in the United States are terrified to speak frankly about Saddam's regime, largely because they are terrified of reprisals against family members. The women are speaking out because they feel they are speaking for the voiceless people living under Saddam's regime.

"We know how it looks like inside Iraq," al-Suwaij said on 20/20. "We saw the torture. We saw our relatives and our friends disappearing day after day."

Human rights groups estimate that at least 290,000 Iraqis have disappeared since Saddam took power 34 years ago. Hussain was just a schoolgirl in Baghdad when the reality of life under Saddam hit home. She recalls riding on a school bus at age 13 and seeing a crowd gathered in the center of the capital, around bodies of men hanging from poles. "I remember the blue faces, the long necks," she said.

Saddam's reign of terror extended far beyond public executions. He established a strategy of brutalizing women in order to control their men. Although the stories these women tell are horrific and difficult to substantiate, they are consistent with a pattern of cruelty toward women documented by various human rights groups.

Routine Rapes, Human Meat Grinders, Chemical Baths

Al-Suwaij knows firsthand how even young girls were imprisoned for what seem to be trivial offenses. Al-Suwaij says she had a 16-year-old cousin who was beaten and tortured with electrical shocks for having written something against the government in her school notebook.

And if a man is a dissident or if a man writes a letter or makes a joke about Saddam, these women said, authorities would rape his wife or female relatives in front of him.

"Rape is used as a tool to humiliate the woman, but to also bring men into submission," Hussain said. To compound the humiliation, authorities would videotape the torture and rape and send the tape to family members.

Saddam's contempt for human rights extended to his well-documented use of poison gas against his own people. The horror of one of those chemical attacks still haunts Michael 16 years later.

"Children, women, men ? vomiting, screaming, crying with swollen eyes. Everybody was ? screaming, 'We are blind. We cannot see,' " Michael said. She said she still has difficulty breathing, because of her exposure to the gas.

Al-Suwaij has seen the inside of an Iraqi prison, and she describes horrific scenes. She said she was shown "human meat grinders" in which people were shredded and disposed of in a septic tank, and chemical baths in which people were literally dissolved.

"You cannot exaggerate about these things. People were slaughtered," she said.

All four women met earlier this month with members of the Bush administration.

They raised the issues they feel need to be addressed in Iraq. They say there needs to be a clear commitment to democracy in Iraq, and that the United States and its allies will need to chaperon the transition.

Protesters Missing the Point

The anti-war demonstrations happening all over the world are disturbing for these women. Rasool believes the protesters are missing the point.

"Knowing what we've been through, knowing what the people in Iraq are going through up to now, and then when we see protesters, that they don't know the reality of the people who are suffering right now," she said. "They don't know about torture, they don't know about rape."


"...the first time I saw Iraq liberated. I saw the joy and the happiness of the people," al-Suwaij said.
Post Fri Sep 19, 2003 6:51 pm
 
mortalthoughts
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i understand that sadaam needed to go
but what i dont like <and is alot of the reason im against the war>

is the way bush fronted like the little bitch that he is
blah blah
Post Fri Sep 19, 2003 6:56 pm
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Wordsmyth
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bush should not even be a variable in your opinion, people were dying, and i've seen it happen.....like it was nothing
Post Fri Sep 19, 2003 6:57 pm
 
The Dude Abides



Joined: 25 Aug 2003
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blunted know what's up
Post Fri Sep 19, 2003 6:58 pm
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Ryan



Joined: 27 Sep 2002
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war on Iraq in 2003 was a bad thing, not war on Iraq..
Post Fri Sep 19, 2003 7:00 pm
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mortalthoughts
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should we worry about our own country first?  Reply with quote  

what about the thousands probbly more people that get murdered in our country

what about all the poverty in our own country
what about a horrable public educatioin system

what about all this class warfare bullshit


and from my understanding theres not enough troops in iraq theyre spread so thin its not safe at all


i dunno i guess we have diff. prespectives on this





edit: and another thing how many innocent iraqis has bush killed since the start of this war?


double edit: and what about a shitt ass economy
a perfectly competent person like myself cant even find a full time job

FUCK THAT I BLAME BUSH!


Last edited by mortalthoughts on Fri Sep 19, 2003 7:16 pm; edited 3 times in total
Post Fri Sep 19, 2003 7:03 pm
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duke_city



Joined: 05 Jul 2002
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I understand Sadaam was a horrible leader and killed off his own people.

How is this an American problem?

Sending US troops to take care of other countries problems doesn't seem like its very fair for America, as a nation we have very little benefit from this war.

Not to be rude or selfish but there is a lot of poverty and bad treatment going on a few blocks down where I live and all over the US for that matter.

Brian
Post Fri Sep 19, 2003 7:04 pm
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futuristxen



Joined: 01 Jul 2002
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um...so could they stop killing our soldiers if they're so happy about us being there?

I think Iraqis are happy Sadaam is gone. But they're not happy that the US is still there. If we had gone in with an international coalition we wouldn't be taking a tremendous shit on them right now. Because of Bush being incompetent at presenting his case to the world, the Iraqi people have to suffer through who knows how long without basic things like water, food, and shelter.

Bush's father would have worked this out through the internation organizations and everyone, us them, would be better off right now. But as it stands, americans are getting screwed by having to foot the bill, and Iraqis are getting screwed because we suck at nation building.

It's not so much that we shouldn't have gone over there, as much as we went about it completely wrong and in the process may have done more harm than good.

290,000 in 34 years...anyone have the numbers thanks to this war? Or for that matter, thanks to sanctions--which are what really hurt iraqis.
Post Fri Sep 19, 2003 7:14 pm
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mortalthoughts
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Wordsmyth wrote:
bush should not even be a variable



yes it should

bushes actions reflect on me <our country,the people>etc etc

its a shame that i get stuck with some bullshit opionon of me because im an american WHEN I COULD DO NOTHING ABOUT IT
Post Fri Sep 19, 2003 7:28 pm
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The Mean Eagle



Joined: 07 Apr 2003
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What about the estimated 10,000,000 Iraqi's dead due to US embargo's and restriction since the gulf was in 91???
not very nice...Something had to be done, but it wasnt exclusively our responsability, but it was W's priorty to keep his best intrists in mind. If he had more tact he would have waited for UN to approve something but he knew they were shying away from his open ended proposals of war.and his post 9-11 momentium was fueling his 'cowboy' politicing.. Only time will tell what happens to Iraqs fate..maybe some U.S. voters could help sway thier future... but who am I kidding???....Love,Jess
Post Fri Sep 19, 2003 7:33 pm
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mortalthoughts
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I wasnt old enough to vote in the last election......

and since when do the peoples votes count anyways
Post Fri Sep 19, 2003 7:36 pm
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Wordsmyth
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Quote:

what about a horrable public educatioin system



you proved your point with the spelling of Horrible....

anyhow, America has molded itself into a 'Big Brother' over the years, which you cannot say is a bad thing. We have made the world a much safer, tranquil place. Fuck your brains if you do not agree with me on that one.....
We went to war because Saddam needed to go, and the CHANCE of WMDs........fuck, if we did not go over there, what would have happend if they actually did have WMD?.....we recieve threats from Iraq so frequent that after 9-11, we're not taking chances anymore.
I can bet you my life savings....($0 .34) that they DID have WMDs, and on the news of a coalition headed in their direction, they were sent to OTHER countries highly capable of killing millions of us here, in America. (Saudi Arabia, Iran...)
We cannot take chances with the risk of the general public at hand...
another 9-11 could happen tomorrow, 3,000 more of innocent women men, children can be killed by the time you lazy asses wake up in the morning.
Fuck if we'll let that happen.
This is a nation backed on freedom, and guess what?....we're by far the most succesful nation in the world. Why not try n spread that?.....
if U.S. can make the world a better place, then let us
Post Fri Sep 19, 2003 7:37 pm
 
duke_city



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[quote="Wordsmyth"]
Quote:


This is a nation backed on freedom, and guess what?....we're by far the most succesful nation in the world. Why not try n spread that?.....
if U.S. can make the world a better place, then let us


I understand everything you said (most of it I agree with) and have two questions for you.

1. Who is Barbara Salters?

2. How long have you been in the military?

Brian
Post Fri Sep 19, 2003 7:41 pm
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Sage Francis
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Wordsmyth,
How old are you and where do you currently go to school?

Just wondering.
Post Fri Sep 19, 2003 7:45 pm
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mattrego



Joined: 26 Jun 2003
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You got alot of heart, but your just a little naive , that's all. We had no business in Iraq, only for the business of Bush.
Post Fri Sep 19, 2003 7:53 pm
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