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do morals(morality?) get taught or...?
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Strange Famous Forum > Social stuff. Political stuff. KNOWMORE

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mortalthoughts
LAME KID


Joined: 12 Dec 2002
Posts: 11616
Location: MI
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i dissagree august
taking a persons life might be justifyed
but that doesnt make it right
Post Sun Aug 24, 2003 2:19 pm
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duke_city



Joined: 05 Jul 2002
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Location: San Diego,CA
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[quote="August Spies"]
Quote:

and how do you decide that? all moral systems I know of consider taking a human life okay in certain circumstances, do you know any that do not or did you not really think before posting?


I suggest you read a book called "Arab and Jew Wounded spirits in a Promised Land" by David Shipler.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0142002291/qid=1061756543/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/103-3463563-3752617?v=glance&s=books

This book explores how Israeli and Palestinian children are raised with the mantality that their "due rights" as a nation to occupy the "West Bank" and "Gaza Strip" are a license to extinguish transgressors and are in fact acts of righteousness.

This kind of upbringing is exactly what I was talking about before.

Brian
Post Sun Aug 24, 2003 2:34 pm
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August Spies



Joined: 09 Aug 2002
Posts: 1979
Location: D.C.
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dallasboy:

obviously there are people who have fucked up views on who should be killed. But ALL societies allow for killing in certain circumstances.
So are you taking back your original statemtn or do you want to argue no noe should ever be killed?


Quote:

taking a persons life might be justifyed
but that doesnt make it right

I'm not sure what distinction you are making. When is something justified but not right?

Would it not be right for me to kill someone in order to prevent a terrorist attack if nothing else could stop it?
Post Sun Aug 24, 2003 2:49 pm
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mortalthoughts
LAME KID


Joined: 12 Dec 2002
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Location: MI
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george bush jusifiyed the war on iraq in his mind?

does that make it right?
Post Sun Aug 24, 2003 2:53 pm
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August Spies



Joined: 09 Aug 2002
Posts: 1979
Location: D.C.
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bluntedinmichigan wrote:
george bush jusifiyed the war on iraq in his mind?
does that make it right?

I would say no, because george bush was WRONG (in my opinion).

However, I did not say everytime someone "justifies" a killing they are right. I am saying that all moral systems allow for murder in certain circumstances.

For example, pretty much everyone would agree on murder in self-defense baring other options.
Post Sun Aug 24, 2003 2:55 pm
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duke_city



Joined: 05 Jul 2002
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August Spies wrote:
dallasboy:

obviously there are people who have fucked up views on who should be killed. But ALL societies allow for killing in certain circumstances.
So are you taking back your original statemtn or do you want to argue no noe should ever be killed?


Quote:

taking a persons life might be justifyed
but that doesnt make it right

I'm not sure what distinction you are making. When is something justified but not right?

Would it not be right for me to kill someone in order to prevent a terrorist attack if nothing else could stop it?


I'll just copy what I typed before.

Any moral system which considers taking a human life ok is fundamentally flawed regardless of reasoning behind it.

If you say that "ALL societies allow for killing in certain circumstances."

Then I say ALL of them are flawed.

But what you said is not true at all.

The teachings of Mahatma Gandhi for example showed there is a way to effectively avoid all forms of violence and still sway tyranny. In his approach to protest there was absolutley no place for killing much less violence of any form.

Brian
Post Sun Aug 24, 2003 2:58 pm
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mortalthoughts
LAME KID


Joined: 12 Dec 2002
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Location: MI
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killing is wrong no matter the circumstances in my opionon....even if it is out of self defence

killing =wrong

killing out of self defence=not as wrong but still wrong
Post Sun Aug 24, 2003 3:03 pm
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August Spies



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Quote:

But what you said is not true at all.


Gahdni is not a society kid. He was one person. No society has ever been able to remain stable while being completely non-violent. Soceityes have wars and criminals


Quote:

The teachings of Mahatma Gandhi for example showed there is a way to effectively avoid all forms of violence and still sway tyranny.

bullshit. Gahndi was only succesful due to LARGE amounts of violence. Most notabaly, the british empire was crippled by two world wars. If thse wars had not happened it is very doubtful that gahndi would have been succesfull.

Secondly, Gahdni and his followers were not the only group active in the push for a free indian state. There were many "violent" gropus at work too. Gahndi would not have been succesfull without them.
Post Sun Aug 24, 2003 3:03 pm
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August Spies



Joined: 09 Aug 2002
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Location: D.C.
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Quote:

killing out of self defence=not as wrong but still wrong

why?
Post Sun Aug 24, 2003 3:04 pm
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mortalthoughts
LAME KID


Joined: 12 Dec 2002
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because killing anybody no matter the reason is wrong
Post Sun Aug 24, 2003 3:06 pm
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August Spies



Joined: 09 Aug 2002
Posts: 1979
Location: D.C.
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bluntedinmichigan wrote:
because killing anybody no matter the reason is wrong


killing is wrong because it is wrong?

circular logic.
Post Sun Aug 24, 2003 3:29 pm
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tinkleDRINKER



Joined: 25 Jul 2002
Posts: 788
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blunted has the "slave morality" and he will be cast out when the "uberman" washes over the earh and corrects the "transvaluation of morals"

hahahahahaha
Post Sun Aug 24, 2003 4:14 pm
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mortalthoughts
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Joined: 12 Dec 2002
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Location: MI
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August Spies wrote:
bluntedinmichigan wrote:
because killing anybody no matter the reason is wrong


killing is wrong because it is wrong?

circular logic.


what good from killing can come?
how can it be right when nothing good comes from it?
Post Sun Aug 24, 2003 4:29 pm
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mortalthoughts
LAME KID


Joined: 12 Dec 2002
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Location: MI
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august please explain where my thought process is flawed

killing=wrong
is it that hard to understand?

just because its allowed does not make it right or okay
Post Sun Aug 24, 2003 4:41 pm
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August Spies



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Quote:

what good from killing can come?
how can it be right when nothing good comes from it?

lot's of fucking good can come from killing.
If someone was about to suicide bomb a busload of people and I (or a cop) shot him in the head I would save a busload of people's lives. I would consider this a good, wouldn't you?

If a brutal dictator invades another country and that country does nothing it would be bad. If that country succesfully defends itself (which obvioulsy would involve killing people) It would be good, imho at least.


Quote:

august please explain where my thought process is flawed
killing=wrong


cause you aren't putting forward an argument. You are just stating your opinion without any thought process.
It is like me saying "cheese is better than ice cream" and asking how my thought process holds up?
Post Sun Aug 24, 2003 4:58 pm
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